Tube amps

Howdy! Going to buy an amp for my electric guitar. I know I want a tube amp. Other then that I know next to nothing. Never going to gig. Just play at home and with friends. Have yet to go play some different amps. Is it a waste of money if I never get the volume past half? Or are there benefits for having a little extra juice. At times I like to play loud but would also like to dial down the volume and still have some cool sounds. Will be purchasing pedals also. Any ideas for amps to go try. Thinking $350-$600.Thanks for any help.

Rock and Roll will Never Die!

Hi Marty,

I just picked up a tube amp and I love it. What was important for me was to have a master volume, effects loop and enough stomp to easily keep up to a hard hitting drummer. For me, a 40 watt Fender Hot Rod IV hit the mark.

I love shopping for gear, have fun!

If you don't want to much noise and " never going to jam with others",( never say never, once you've played together with others it's kind of addicting ) then look for an amp with just one speaker, I have a Fender Hotrod Deville 410 MK I, it's only 60 watts but it will blow out your ears until they hurt if you crank it open, a 15 to 25 watt will do nice for you but it all depends on the sound you are looking for, if you like more of a bluesy sound then go for a Fender type amp, if you are more into rock and metal then go for a Marshall type of amp, one importend thing; if you want to use stomp boxes then make sure the clean channel of the amp can handle that, many amps start to distort from the moment you connect a stomp box to them and that is not what you want.

Herman

Thanks for the input!

Originally Posted by: marty farcalI know I want a tube amp.[/quote]

Two questions. Do you? Why?

Originally Posted by: marty farcal Other then that I know next to nothing.[/quote]

No disrespect, but if you "know next to nothing", you don't "know" why you would want or need a tube amp. Understandably, something has impressed you with the belief you do.

I have several amps including a ball tearer of a tube amp which I love, but if I had to have only one all rounder for home studio use, it wouldn't be a tube amp.

Originally Posted by: marty farcalIs it a waste of money if I never get the volume past half?

A tube amp? Yes.

Well not a waste of money exactly, but tube amps really are at their best tonally when you are pushing them. The way around that if you want to play at reduced volumes, is to buy a small wattage tube amp. But, there's always a but isn't there, tube amps require maintenance, and are more expensive generally. Of course the latter is an individual budget and affordability thing.

[quote=marty farcal]Or are there benefits for having a little extra juice.

Of course. You can figure those out for yourself. But at home, you won't use that as often as the opposite. That's where digital amps offer superior versatility in the particular.

[quote=marty farcal]Will be purchasing pedals also. Any ideas for amps to go try. Thinking $350-$600.

In that price range you have heaps to choose from. First thing you need to consider is the dominant tone you want from your amp determined by your preferred music genre. Tube amps sound different depending upon the preamp and power tubes they use along with other aspects of the proprietary circuitary design.

Seriously [u]if it's your first amp intended for home use[/u], you really are better off buying something 'can't go wrong' versatile like a BOSS Katana 50 Mk II. Learn with it and spend the serious money on something different when you know more about amps and can better appreciate from hands on experience what you really want. I say that without being anti or pro digital or tube, a Katana fanboi, or even owning/wanting a Katana amp in particular. If I did I'd have one. I do currently own and use 7 amps excluding my 300W PA or amp sim pedals.

manXcat thank you for the thoughts. I love the tone of a couple tube amps I have heard in years past. I currently have a Johnson Marquis JM 120. I read somewhere that tubes last longer nowadays. Don't know if it is true or not. I'm thinking 20 watts max. Guess I should probably put the guitars down and go on a demo run.

Originally Posted by: marty farcal

manXcat thank you for the thoughts. I love the tone of a couple tube amps I have heard in years past. I currently have a Johnson Marquis JM 120. I read somewhere that tubes last longer nowadays. Don't know if it is true or not. I'm thinking 20 watts max. Guess I should probably put the guitars down and go on a demo run.

[br]Had to look that up (Johnson Marquis JM 120). Demo run plan sounds good.

I agree that tube amps sound sweet, so I get where you're coming from, but the tonal gap has closed a lot in recent years. I'm only going on end user reports myself from what I've read and seen that Tube amps are pretty reliable these days, and vacuum tube life is reportedly good, but am aware that they still need tubes replaced to a schedule every couple of years/(n) playing hours to keep sounding their best, unscheduled replacement occasionally, and design dependent, biasing. If you're tech minded and prepared to invest the time into learning to do it yourself and buy the couple of necessary tools so you can do it yourself, it's a minor expense and inconvenience. Typically many small tube amps only have a single preamp and power tube whereas a Vox AC30 has 3 preamp tubes and 4 power tubes although the majority of combos most fall in between these parameters.

Seriously, for scales and much other stuff including learning parts, much of the time out of sheer convenience I use just my 3W Blackstar Fly 3 running on batteries unless I'm chasing tone or trying to perfect a nuance e.g. swapping between the clean rhythm vs fuzz and booster pedals for the melody line of "Satisfaction" on the RF bypass channel of one of my amps with that feature, or simply just want to let loose for the pure enjoyment of it.

My TVP amp blew away any preconceptions about digital vs tube. I have both for direct comparison and, selected to 6L6 it's impressive beside the real thing. I like both, but the TVP is more versatile. It's grin factor is massive. If I had to choose just one amp, it'd be it. But I'd probably buy a Fly 3 or similar additionally anyway even if money was tight.

That said, the small tube amps are great too. Everyone makes one. Choose your preferred brand characteristic tone and tube, and just go with whichever floats your boat, especially if you can afford another amp or to change if it turns out it wasn't what you expected.

My ears must be easy to please, as I haven't bought an amp yet that I don't like respecting its expected characteristics, strengths and limitations, or which can't find some positive attribute in.

It helps to know what kind of music you intend to play, what your home situation Is, bedroom, larger space etc and to realize that not all tube amps are equal.

example, I started with a small 15w 12" amp. It was too smal, broke up too early, not the sound I wantedl. I then tried a fender 100w Mustang modeling amp which I still have, it's fantastic although not a true 100 watter. Great for quiet or loud home use, it came with a software interface that included all kinds of modeled Amp presets and a ton of effects which could be tailored.

i then decided to go for a Fender custom vibrolux reverb with 2 10" speakers, 30 watts.

ive never unplugged from that amp in 1.5 years. Great for home use, loud if need be. I'll never go back to a 1x12[br]the benefit of that particular amp is that versatile, takes pedals extremely well without an effects loop and it's two amps in one. Custom side is fender bassman, good meaty clean tone. Vintage side is sparkly, diamond on glass, clean. [br]for my taste, it would be a tube amp because the sound is unique, but that's me. Ultimately only you know what you like.

you will need to learn a few things because tubes do wear out, some are faulty even when new. So if you're prepared to deal with inevitable maintenance ie tube changes & their expense, go for a tube amp.

I wouldn't worry about the service side of tube amps personally, tubes take a lot of hrs playing them at crancked volumes to wear out, I change the tubes on my main gigging amp every two years just as good practice and that amp gets a lot of play time at loud volumes so using a tube amp at home with lower volumes when you are not pushing the tubes hard at all they will last a long time, plus it's only the phase invertor and power tubes that do most of the hard work so you don't need to change all of the tubes. The electrolytic capacitors will need replacing every 6-10 years but that's not too expensive to have done if you don't have the correct knowledge on how to do it yourself.

I do all my own amp servicing and most of the repairs plus I do the same for several of my friends amps and have built a few from scratch, from my experience newer amp are no where near as well built as the stuff from the 60's to early 80's but everything seems to be built cheap these days.

But if you really want that tube tone you need a tube amp. Do your research well before buying and decide what features you want and need, different tubes do make a small difference in tone and sit in different frequency ranges, for example the 6L6 has tighter bass and treble response whilst an EL34 has a looser bass response but more mid and allows the mids to cut through a bit more but transformers make a bigger difference especially the output transformer so take that into consideration when doing your research.

Hey Marty

Here are a couple of links you might also find helpful which I used in the course of bringing myself up to speed.

The first, Eurotube will give you some idea of maintenance required/do-it-yourself costs involved with a tube amp (vs digital which is nada).

This one (in two parts) explains how it all works on the inside. Don't need to know this stuff to play which might be too technical for the need or interest of many, but it's gold for the inquiring mind that just 'needs to know'.

Lastly, a few suggestions from the too many to choose from.

[br]For a home studio/practise tube amp, I like this one which sits in your preferred price range -specs, price & reviews here. Alternatively for a little more but still with your budget, one of these, the 6L6 (demo) being my particular favourite. Or, choose a Studio 10 in your own preferred tube flavour, 6L6, EL34 or KT88.

Brand bias disclaimer: I own and play a Blackstar Artist Blonde 30W 6L6 2x12" combo amongst others, but I'm not blind to other brands also owning two Fender amps one of which is a 2x12" solid state combo I'd buy again. Any bias is preference for the 'ambitious and hungry for recognition new boy on the block' performance:value ratio of Blackstar amps.

Hi

I have a Laney Cub r this as a 1w input so you can push it plus a 15w input also a cabinet output plus a FX loop.

I upgraded the valves to JJs and the speaker to a Celestion Vintage 30 and on 1w it ROCKs.

In the Uk this cost about £300 so would be in your budget.

Barry

Hey Marty

1st I have to admit that the only reason I purchased the Fender is because I thought the two tone was really cool looking and after playing it in store I said "yup, sounds fine to me", and I walked out with it.

However, now that I own it, I am impressed with how much information is available on this amp. I'm talking YouTube and websites. Mods, maintenance... you name it.

So again, that wasn't the reason I purchased it, buts it's great to have all that info available.

When it comes to guitars, motorcycles, cars... I buy what turns me on at the time. No more thought is put into it than that.

Let us know what you end up with.

FYI

Originally Posted by: William MG

Hey Marty

1st I have to admit that the only reason I purchased the Fender is because I thought the two tone was really cool looking and after playing it in store I said "yup, sounds fine to me", and I walked out with it.

However, now that I own it, I am impressed with how much information is available on this amp. I'm talking YouTube and websites. Mods, maintenance... you name it.

So again, that wasn't the reason I purchased it, buts it's great to have all that info available.

When it comes to guitars, motorcycles, cars... I buy what turns me on at the time. No more thought is put into it than that.

Let us know what you end up with.

FYI

Those Fender Hot Rod IV are also really good at taking pedals which makes it a nice versatile amp, you should be able to make any type of music using that William MG.

This thread has reminded me that I have a Jet City 20HV sat in a corner I've been meaning to mod for a while so I think I'll have to break out the soldering iron at some point and get onto that project.

Yes, I am really enjoying it Fuzz. When I do run a pedal, I run my Boss Blues Driver more than any other. I haven't biased it and although I read online that Fender tends to set the bias a bit on the cold side to provide longer life to the tubes, I don't think I will touch it. Maybe after a few months of playing, but for now I am happy with it as is. If I do anything, it would be only to get a bench mark read on what the bias is now.

You will have to give us details on potential mods to your Jet.

Originally Posted by: William MG

Yes, I am really enjoying it Fuzz. When I do run a pedal, I run my Boss Blues Driver more than any other. I haven't biased it and although I read online that Fender tends to set the bias a bit on the cold side to provide longer life to the tubes, I don't think I will touch it. Maybe after a few months of playing, but for now I am happy with it as is. If I do anything, it would be only to get a bench mark read on what the bias is now.

You will have to give us details on potential mods to your Jet.

I think most amp companies will set the bias cold from the factory but as long as you like the tone that's the most important, I personally do like to adjust the bias on any amp when I get them so I can find that sweet spot that suits my style of playing.

The Jet City amp I have I'll be doing a couple of things to, I've bought a choke to install in it, I'll also be changing the plate load resistors to some higher quality ones. Both of those mods should make it perform quieter at high volumes and if needed I may cut the traces on the PCB that supply the filament heater voltage and install wires twisted in a hum cancelling method, so a few things to do to it when I get a spare day but I think it will be well worth doing.

Originally Posted by: fuzzb0x

Originally Posted by: William MG

Yes, I am really enjoying it Fuzz. When I do run a pedal, I run my Boss Blues Driver more than any other. I haven't biased it and although I read online that Fender tends to set the bias a bit on the cold side to provide longer life to the tubes, I don't think I will touch it. Maybe after a few months of playing, but for now I am happy with it as is. If I do anything, it would be only to get a bench mark read on what the bias is now.

You will have to give us details on potential mods to your Jet.

The Jet City amp I have I'll be doing a couple of things to, I've bought a choke to install in it, I'll also be changing the plate load resistors to some higher quality ones. Both of those mods should make it perform quieter at high volumes and if needed I may cut the traces on the PCB that supply the filament heater voltage and install wires twisted in a hum cancelling method, so a few things to do to it when I get a spare day but I think it will be well worth doing.

You're over my head here but that's ok. This is how we learn. I'd be interested in what a choke does and what a plate resistor is and does.

Originally Posted by: William MG

Originally Posted by: fuzzb0x

Originally Posted by: William MG

Yes, I am really enjoying it Fuzz. When I do run a pedal, I run my Boss Blues Driver more than any other. I haven't biased it and although I read online that Fender tends to set the bias a bit on the cold side to provide longer life to the tubes, I don't think I will touch it. Maybe after a few months of playing, but for now I am happy with it as is. If I do anything, it would be only to get a bench mark read on what the bias is now.

You will have to give us details on potential mods to your Jet.

The Jet City amp I have I'll be doing a couple of things to, I've bought a choke to install in it, I'll also be changing the plate load resistors to some higher quality ones. Both of those mods should make it perform quieter at high volumes and if needed I may cut the traces on the PCB that supply the filament heater voltage and install wires twisted in a hum cancelling method, so a few things to do to it when I get a spare day but I think it will be well worth doing.

You're over my head here but that's ok. This is how we learn. I'd be interested in what a choke does and what a plate resistor is and does.

No problem William MG, the choke is there to help smooth out any ripples left after the AC has been converted to DC by the rectifier stage and the plate load resistors create a voltage drop on the plate of the tube when current is flowing through the tube. But without getting into too much detail which would really be best placed in a thread of it's own it's also connected to the B+ power supply so at high volumes with a decent amount of gain they can be a bit noisy on some amps, this isn't too much of a problem most of the time and will only be noticeable at high volumes but I only use this Jet City amp as part of my recording rig so I want it to be as silent as possible, plus I enjoy tweaking my gear so it's just an excuse for me to open the amp up really

Here's a link to some good reading if you decide to learn a bit more on how tube amps work

https://robrobinette.com/Amp_Stuff.htm

I ended up buying a Marshall DSL20. I'm as happy as a kid in a candy store! Thanks for all the help.

Marty

Originally Posted by: fuzzb0x

Here's a link to some good reading if you decide to learn a bit more on how tube amps work

https://robrobinette.com/Amp_Stuff.htm

Interesting guy, and albeit in need of a bit of a cleanup and rambling reorg, a valuable site fuzz. I hadn't come across it before. [u]Many thanks[/u] for that link.

Originally Posted by: marty farcal

I ended up buying a Marshall DSL20. I'm as happy as a kid in a candy store! Thanks for all the help.

Marty